Briar Quality

[alfredo_buscatti]

I've been looking at a lot of pipes lately and remembered that some claim certain briar is better; that pre-Trans Barlings, of no particular repute when compared to today's artisan pipes, are valuable due to old wood while old GBDs and Charatans are not. I thought to solve this by reading online and find widely divergent opinions. Bill Unger in Pipedia,

http://pipedia.org/index.php?title=100_Year_Old_Briar%3F

has a no-nonsense view that says wood is wood, nature nature, and that growing conditions of soil and climate determine which wood is better. R.D. Field, presumably, at

http://www.rdfield.com/Articles/What%20Makes...,%20part%201.htm

states that briar is not briar and that origin, age, weight and curing determine its quality.

Of particular note is Field's statement that "it is generally recognized that in order to have a superior smoking pipe the briar from which it is made must be at least fifty years old. It is only with age that the briar root becomes tight enough, dense enough to withstand both the heat of lighted tobacco and the juices produced during smoking for very long periods of time. Whereas the pores of less-aged briar tend to clog from absorption in a relatively short time the well-aged briar absorbs much less in a given smoke and so should last for decades if well-treated by the smoker."

Both seem to be correct. Is the truth a mixture of these opinions?

 

[Briar Spirit]

Bad link Buddy: http://pipedia.org/wiki/100_Year_Old_Briar%3F


I've often wondered about this myself, will be interesting to see what some pipe makers here have to say.

 

[alfredo_buscatti]

Thanks! Fixed.

 

[osci]

Very interesting topic!
I read both the linked articles and to be honest i dont know...maybe the truth may be in the middle?
By the way i will report the point of view of pipemaker Salvatore Amorelli, the text is taken from an email published in an italian pipesmokers forum. In the mail he answers to a forum's user that was wondering if it is possible to be able to recognize the origin of the root(which region) when smoking the pipe.(Amoreli says YES!)

Dear Mr. Stefano
thank you for the questions to which I will try to answer it from the technical point of view, then it's up to you to judge whether to confirm, deny or investigate the claims of the User Forum is referring to. We start from the root.

1) We use almost exclusively the Sicilian chocolate heather, gathered in Nebrodi - Peloritani from cioccaioli, children and
grandchildren in turn cioccaioli of performing this work has always been in a territory assigned to them by the Forestry to
Use pasture. Heather to develop a log "significant" must have 30 to 40 years and the most beautiful grow
mysteriously climb where only goats! It 'a preamble to say that the world revolves around
pipe is very special: if you happen to come to Sicily, I'll talk to will tell you that cioccaioli
what emotion experience after having sorted out from the land of chocolate quell'erica who grew up with them.

2) Cut the chocolate and boiling the pieces in copper cauldrons.
The sawyers (all Calabrian) cut the log according to the procedures of experience and measures given at the beginning of the century
last year by the British. The sawn timber are boiled and after three / four months are marketed. Boiling, a time
occurred only in tanks made of copper. After nearly all the sawyers have opted, no one knows
because, for steel. I would not say too much but I assure you that there is a great difference in the treated product:
that boiled in a copper cauldron, has a warm color, honey (whitish in steel) and also the smell and taste
are different. Then it is important to change the water: it must be frequent, the pieces are taken out of the
right time .... It is clear therefore that if the manufacturer has a good relationship (not only economic) with the
sawyer and explains how he wants the game to cut chocolate, how long to boil (beyond 24 hours)
cauldrons exclusively copper and more, we are asking the basis for a material which has a history
at least different from others.

3) The aging of the sketches.
After three / four months of the boiling, the sawyer marketing the product. The factories buy sketches and
artisans plates flames. Some "force" drying in heated before or after processing
the "heads" of pipe (how many times have we seen mouthpieces that are released from the torch?) Personally I think that
only a long maturation period of the sketch helps to improve the performance of our work (there
notice in the processing: the "cool" is a long-chipping when drilled and is very "soft" to
sanding the long cheese is hard, knocking two pieces to each other you will hear a sound almost
metal, it is very hard under the sanding disks and the chip is pulverized immediately). So, not six months or a year
but many more, even 10 or 15 years because, I assure you from personal experience, that the pipe is good, heats less,
is lighter than "know" less than wood, "you" first, less water is ...... Of course, this requires a great sacrifice (in
economic terms) accumulate year after year sawn log, selected one by one and wait a long time before
decide to work them running the risk, as is the case, to see them pierced by termites (it is known that the worm is
a "gourmet" prefers rich woods and very old). So long and good climate for the seasoning
prior to machining.

4) The processing
I can not help but mention the pipe handmade in workshops where artisans, from 1 to 5 or so
contribute with their work from the conception of the model to the finished product: the hole in the cooker with
right conicity and that of the torch, with its diameter, at the base of the cooker: the pin of the mouthpiece in material
break or without expansion chamber in the torch, with the dental mouthpiece of the right thickness. A processing
without haste, respecting the "suggestions" of the grain and final polishing strictly for non carnauba
occlude the pores of the wood. And if you need the "charcoal" inside, this is done only with a type of wood.

I tried to summarize what's behind a pipe. Moreover, one should keep in mind that it is correct to say smoking a pipe rather than smoking the pipe. It enhances the taste of tobacco and urges all the senses, gustatory, olfactory, visual, tactile and the hearing (the sound of puffs) and if you add to this that 'knowledge' efforts in the subject and the story I tried to tell, then it may be a smoker, more informed and impressed in the calculations sometimes extravagant that we realize, can "read" even the emotions that have built the pipe elected to Favorites perhaps explaining his way with an enthusiasm that can not hold.
It 'obvious that between smoking a cigar and a MIXTUR of tobacco, there is no difference, but some "similarity" is, then try to smoke a cigar with some cracks in the band or with spots of mold or even try to smoke with your eyes closed without being able to enjoy his favorite shape, manufacturing, contact ..... and wisps of blue smoke.
I hope to have contributed to the friends and fans of tasting tobacco.


Friendliness
Salvatore Amorelli

Please forgive me for the poor google translation work, i was too lazy to translate myself.

 

[Wet Dottle]

Interesting topic. I've read lots of contradictory information, all from reputable sources, and don't know what to believe.

Thanks for the post, Osci.

 

[Anonymous]

The testimony of a master artisan, based on long and scrupulously attentive experience, is worth immeasurably more that the pontifications of a hundred armchair theorists who imagine that by reducing everything real, immediate & tangible to an abstraction (a concept), they can predict outcomes based on manipulating these.

You see exactly this same state of affairs in attempts to "explain" the mysteries of violins by Stradivari, Guarneri del Gesu et al. Many of these clowns, armed with mathematics and sophisticated analytical tools, even conclude that modern replicas of them are superior. Because they cannot measure the differences, they conclude that the differences between them don't exist.

But theory and reality remain two different matters.

This "scientific expert" approach has produced 100+ years of pompously self-assured nonsense that does not conform to the actual experience of actual people playing (and hearing) the actual instruments involved.

Eschew abstractions. "Justice," reduced to an abstraction, = imposing "affirmative action hiring quotas."

FWIW

:face:

 

[Sasquatch]

Huh... I never figured on agreeing with a whole post of Yak's, but there it is.

The reductionism of trying to understand a good vs bad pipe is possible to a degree, but there are factors that simply aren't measurable (my enjoyment of blend X in the pipe vs yours) so we can only go on experience in some of this.


I've bugged cutters for information and generally gotten very similar feedback. If you ask how old the plants are, they say "30 years to 50 years about - before 30, the burl is too small. After 50, many burls are defective in some way".

I think the confusion in the last paragraph of the OP here is that plants don't get any "tighter" as they get older. Fast growing plants grow fast, slow growing plants grow slow. So I think what he's trying to get it regarding porosity (and I agree only somewhat) is that slower-growth briar with higher grain density makes better pipes. I think this. But the "blocking up of pores" idea is surely wrong - oil curing a pipe does nothing BUT block up the pores, for example.

Slow-growth briar certainly smokes different than the lighter, less dense kind. Not everyone will agree that it's better, but it's not identical, in my experience. As far as I can tell, what it does is act as a better insulator on the walls of the bowl - keeping the heat in, and returning it to the tobacco, for an effortless burn. A guy who smokes really slow will appreciate this. A guy who smokes bitey virginias might like a briar that absorbs those sharp flavors (like a balsa filter can). So to say that one is inferior really is a stretch - some blocks are better at some things than others. It's much easier to sandblast the less dense briar, for example.....

So, as in all things pipey, there's not going to be one right, "reduced" answer that works for everyone. And why should there be??

 

[KevinM]

Suppose I drive over to the B&M Pipe Emporium and announce my intention to choose a New Year's pipe. He puts half a dozen or so on the counter. I then ask, "Which has the best briar?" I think he'd interpret that as meaning best grain and fewest visible flaws. If I'd say, "Nonono, I mean oldest, hardest, from the best spot on the mountain." He'd likely reply on the basis of brand, not oldest, etc, which is (are) unknowables, it seems to me. What you need to know about the briar is partially revealed by your examination of the finished product as it sits on the pipe shop counter, and the rest is gradually revealed after an extended period of setting the match to pipeweed. I'd say you can improve your chances of buying good wood by sticking to a trusted brand, but, really, even "trusted brands" can use the same briar in "rejects" they do in firsts. There's always a certain amount of hazard in operation.

 

[Rad Davis]

Huh... I never figured on agreeing with a whole post of Yak's, but there it is.

The reductionism of trying to understand a good vs bad pipe is possible to a degree, but there are factors that simply aren't measurable (my enjoyment of blend X in the pipe vs yours) so we can only go on experience in some of this.


I've bugged cutters for information and generally gotten very similar feedback. If you ask how old the plants are, they say "30 years to 50 years about - before 30, the burl is too small. After 50, many burls are defective in some way".

I think the confusion in the last paragraph of the OP here is that plants don't get any "tighter" as they get older. Fast growing plants grow fast, slow growing plants grow slow. So I think what he's trying to get it regarding porosity (and I agree only somewhat) is that slower-growth briar with higher grain density makes better pipes. I think this. But the "blocking up of pores" idea is surely wrong - oil curing a pipe does nothing BUT block up the pores, for example.

Slow-growth briar certainly smokes different than the lighter, less dense kind. Not everyone will agree that it's better, but it's not identical, in my experience. As far as I can tell, what it does is act as a better insulator on the walls of the bowl - keeping the heat in, and returning it to the tobacco, for an effortless burn. A guy who smokes really slow will appreciate this. A guy who smokes bitey virginias might like a briar that absorbs those sharp flavors (like a balsa filter can). So to say that one is inferior really is a stretch - some blocks are better at some things than others. It's much easier to sandblast the less dense briar, for example.....

So, as in all things pipey, there's not going to be one right, "reduced" answer that works for everyone. And why should there be??

What the hell, I agree with Squatch, so by proxy, I agree with Yak.

There are many "truths" in pipe smoking, most of which are arrived at by a consensus among people that are mostly guessing. :twisted:

Rad

 

[Kyle Weiss]

Woah, the world really did just end, Sas and Rad agreeing with Yak? :lol: The Mayans were right.

While everyone can pull from historical and/or educated guesses, when I start hearing the flowery words used to describe the briar, clever monikers for them, painting a beautiful picture of who picks them and finishes the landscape with the best sunset since the dawn of time, the iron doors of my gray matter slam shut.

Briar speculation and origin is like many things in the pipeworld, and I took it down to its element: on one pipe, just one specific pipe, how does the briar taste? I think it was Greg that queried that in another discussion about pipe engineering, I concluded that even if the damn thing is drilled like shyte, does the briar lend itself a positive, neutral or negative flavor? If it is positive at best, or neutral as a trade-off, I think this is a good thing. If you have a close relationship with a carver that might have gotten a good batch of the wood, it's possible you might want to consider another pipe if you can, because there's a better chance the briar came from the same lot. Still, a gamble but...

...like picking up a cat or a dog, do you want "fine bloodlines and pedigree" or can you by chance get a solid friend from a shelter, one that might have been rejected and overlooked by others?

*shrug* My pedestrian, commoner view.

8)

 

[Anonymous]

For giggles, I copied that this morning, and turned it into what I think he was saying :

Dear Mr. Stefano,

Thank you for the questions which I will try to answer from the perspective of my experience. It's up to you to affirm my conclusions, disagree with them, or investigate the matter for yourself.

Start with the bole itself.

1) We use, almost exclusively, boles from Sicilian subspecies of Heather, gathered in Nebrodi by the Peloritani family from Cioccaioli, whose children and grandchildren continue their ancestral tradition of briar harvesting in the territory assigned to them by the Forestry Administration.

A heather shrub, in order to develop a usable bole, must have grown for 30 to 40 years ; strangely perhaps, the most beautiful briar of all grows in spots only goats can reach ! It goes without saying that pipes properly made of it have a special place in the estimation of the world's pipe smokers. If you ever visit Sicily, I will be happy to speak with you about what I've learned about this from a lifetime of experience with it.

2) After cutting comes boiling the briar blocks in copper cauldrons.

The sawyers (all Calabrian) cut the bole according to the procedures, and to the dimensions, established at the beginning of the last century
by the British importers. The sawn blocks are boiled and, after three or four months, are marketed.

For optimum results, the boiling must be done only in cauldrons made of copper --not steel ! I assure you that there is a great difference in the treated product : briar boiled in a copper cauldron has a warm, honey color ; briar boiled in a steel cauldron has a whitish color and also a different smell and taste.

And it is important to change the water : it must be changed frequently and the blocks must be taken out at the right time.

It is obvious, therefore, that if the manufacturer has a good relationship (personal as well as economic) with the sawyer, and explains how he wants him to boil the harvested blocks (longer than the minimum 24 hours) -- and exclusively in copper cauldrons -- this and more drive the price of quality briar up higher than what ordinary briar costs.

3) Now for the aging of the blocks :

After three or four months after the boiling, the sawyer markets the briar. The factories buy the run-of-the-mill blocks and artisans the most beautifully figured ones. Some hasten the drying time by heating them before or after turning the stummels. (How many times have you encountered stems that are loose as a result ?) Personally I think that only a long maturation period of the stummels helps us achieve the the results we do.

We notice in working with them that the the drill bits pull long ribbons of briar when it is not properly seasoned (still green) and it is soft when sanded. Briar that is properly seasoned is hard -- it has an almost metalic sound when two pieces of it are knocked together, and drilling it produces chips rather than curls.

So, not six months or a year of seasoning are necessary, but many more, -- even 10 or 15 -- years because I assure you from personal experience that the pipe will be better, will have less of a tendency to overheat, will be lighter in weight, and smoke drier.

Of course, it involves a great expense (in economic terms) to accumulate blocks for years, selecting them one by one after long seasoning when they are ready to work, running the risk in the mean time that they will be attacked by termites (termites are "gourmets" that prefer rich-tasting, old wood).

4) The processing

I cannot help but mention that pipes which are handmade in workshops where craftsmen -- from 1 to 5 or so of them -- all contribute from the conception of the model to the finished product are noteworthy. The chamber must have the right interior shape, the draft hole -- of a proper diameter -- must be centered carefully at the bottom of it, the joint where the mouthpiece meets the shank must be smooth, and a uniform airway diameter maintained right out to a bit of the proper thickness. The work on it must proceed without haste, the shape in keeping with what the figuration of the briar suggests, and the final polishing done properly because non-carnauba waxes occlude the pores of the wood. And if you want a coated bowl interior, the "charcoal" inside it must be made only of a type of wood.

I have tried to summarize what goes into the creation of a good pipe. In conclusion, you should keep in mind that you want to be smoking a good pipe -- not just "a pipe." A good one will enhance the taste of tobacco and appeals to all the senses, gustatory, olfactory, visual, tactile and the hearing (the sound of puffs). If you add to these the background knowledge of what goes into the creation of one, then you may experience in smoking it what we have tried to put into it for you.

There is an obvious difference between smoking a cigar and a MIXTURE of tobacco. But there is just as much of a similarity between smoking a poor pipe and smoking a cigar with cracks in the band, or with spots of mold. Or even with trying to smoke with your eyes closed, not being able to enjoy the way your pipe looks, its expert craftsmanship, the feel of it in the hand ..... and its wisps of blue smoke.

I hope to have contributed something to the friends and devotees of enjoying tobacco.

With Friendly Regards,

Salvatore Amorelli

:face:

Many thanks to Osci for the corrections !

 

[puros_bran]

Yall dwell on this stuff to much..

One of my pipe hero's said (rough paraphrase) Stuff it in the bowl, set it on fire, puff.

 

[osci]

@Yak, thank you for the great job!
I compared your translation with the original italian text and i must say that is almost perfect, you really got the sense of it.
For the sake of precision let me just amend this part:

"We notice in working with them that the the drill bits pull long ribbons of briar when it is properly seasoned and it is soft when sanded. Briar that is force-dried is hard -- it has an almost metalic sound when two pieces of it are knocked together, and drilling it produces chips rather than curls."

What Mr. Amorelli says is the opposite: " We notice in working with them that the drill bits pull long ribbons of briar when it is not properly seasoned(still fresh) and it it is soft when sanded. Briar that is properly seasoned it has an almost metallic sound when two pieces of it are knocked togheter, and drilling it produces chips rather than curls."

 

[Anonymous]

Thank You for the correction, Osci !

I am revising it accordingly

:face:

 

[Zeno Marx]

Amorelli pipes. They do some odd carving on their pipes. I haven't heard much about them, so I'm not here to comment on their quality. I do have a question though. I consistently see "bare" wood on the pipes. I mean...grainless wood. Absolutely no grain on them. They can almost look like plastic because they're so devoid of any grain, not just devoid of aesthetically pleasing grain. And the stain they use is very light, so it doesn't hide any of this from the buyer. That's a good thing if you ask me. So, does anyone have experience with them? How do they smoke? How's the quality? I see that they do some relatively intricate stem work and with the stem-to-shank. It's just such a strange looking wood. And for them to be $500+? I'm not a grain person. I prefer rusticated pipes. But these really stick out on the market. Any opinions?

 

[Musicus]

Interesting topic. I've read lots of contradictory information, all from reputable sources, and don't know what to believe.

Thanks for the post, Osci.

I like your comment.

 

[ftrplt]

Ahem...Y'all do realize this a 2012 thread!! I admit it was good to see some of our "seldom seen" Brothers and their quotes!! FTRPLT