RADICE TWIN BORE CONTROVERSY

[RDPipes]

I been hearing controversy over how the Radice Twin Bore's were constructed. Some are saying that it did in fact have a "V" connecting the two draw holes at the button while others say it doesn't. Now being that I have no experience with Radice twin bores except for ones I've seen and one I own I ask you for your experience. From what I've seen and the limited research I've done I find that they may have been done both ways. Also let me add that the ones I've had in my hand that were "V'd" so to speak were done horribly and unprofessional in my eye and I don't think Mr. Radice would have done that. Now here are two documents showing the "V" in a clear stem and two separate holes in a black. Did they in fact make them both ways or was the clear stems the only ones to use the "V"?

 

[Richard Burley]

No sabe nada, senor, but I had a thought while reading your query: what if someone made a pipe with a twin bore that extended all the way to the bowl, with two draft holes? Wonder how that would work? Betcha it would stay lit.

 

[Anonymous]

Interesting. Looking at the top one and the second, they appear different processes. I think the top might have been hand drawn or showed a defect in looking at the "waist" on the right side -- symmetry should be present. One has a tapered bore lower and the other is straight.

I'm not sure how you'd make the second one without casting it. Be difficult to step larger inside without some rather fancy tooling. If that expansion were round it make for flow disruption. Manufactured stems could probably come closest using some form of lost wax process to create the unique dimensions.

I only had one twin bore and that was a replacement stem and just a short V to where the normal drilling stopped. I doubt it was a hand cut stem.

 

[Kyle Weiss]

Something tells me these were designed as gimmick first, and the production process experimented happened later.  I can see a two-piece design that simply split an open "delta" in the airway of a prefabricated stem, and I can see how a three-stage drilling design could be applied to solid stem stock.   Who knows, both could have happened.   Many "improvements" happened when pipes were in their more popular eras, some worked, some were bunk.  

Problem with a double-draft hole pipe (ala Richard's idea):  cleaning mid-smoke and blockage.  Naturally, I think most designers would be inclined to make two smaller draft holes rather than one larger bore.   If one gets clogged or messy, there's no telling where a pipe cleaner would go when you're halfway through a bowl.   All you know is the flow would be diminished by half, and you're cursing because the cleaner won't go to the right one when you need to swab out the left.   :lol: 

One thing I did think about was a horizontally-flatter, oval-shaped draft hole.  It'd be hell to drill properly, but if done right, I can see being better for moisture accumulation and blockage, without having too wide a draft, while preventing that one pesky piece of tobacco that clogs up the works.  Also, with the way surface tension works with water moisture, any present would move to the narrower sides leaving the center more open.

This is probably how Peterson Systems, Brigham's rock maple inserts, stingers and even this twin bore idea came about originally.    Guys building a better mousetrap (or just selling it that way).   :lol:

 

[Richard Burley]

 

Problem with a double-draft hole pipe (ala Richard's idea):  cleaning mid-smoke and blockage.  Naturally, I think most designers would be inclined to make two smaller draft holes rather than one larger bore.   If one gets clogged or messy, there's no telling where a pipe cleaner would go when you're halfway through a bowl.   All you know is the flow would be diminished by half, and you're cursing because the cleaner won't go to the right one when you need to swab out the left

No, no, you silly! Dual channels all the way to da' bowl. The stem/shank connection might get interesting, but it could be done. Even a square shank comes to mind, if necessary. Am I interested in this? Not really, but surely there are other geniuses out there who might give it a try...and then throw the result into the fireplace or eBay it.

 

[Kyle Weiss]

No, no, you silly! Dual channels all the way to da' bowl. The stem/shank connection might get interesting, but it could be done. Even a square shank comes to mind, if necessary. Am I interested in this? Not really, but surely there are other geniuses out there who might give it a try...and then throw the result into the fireplace or eBay it.

That's what I meant, a double-draft hole pipe! Maybe the design in my head wasn't quite complete. :mrgreen:   It's entirely possible, but I can see it being more trouble than it's worth.   Stem aligning would be fine, just gotta have a mark on the shank and the stem to match up. How about three draft holes? OR FOUR? :twisted: :tongue:

 

[RDPipes]

Gentlemen, I appreciate your comments and ideas but, they really don't answer the question at hand. These stems were cast, there's just no other way of drilling them straight and bring them together in a "Y" midway stem.
The question is the "V" at the button. The button for those of you that don't know is the end of the stem that your teeth engage.

 

[Kyle Weiss]

I tried to add some conjecture to the situation; I don't really know.

I have seen pieces of vulcanite and acrylic joined in multiple pieces, from stem extensions to surrogate tenons. It's quite possible a standard button-hole (not even sure if that's the right term) could have a piece inserted just right, and then re-drilled or shaped to have a "dual exhaust." I imagine it's also possible to drill a solid piece this way, too.

<img class="emojione" alt="?" title=":shrug:" src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/emojione/assets/png/1f937.png?v=2.2.7"/>

Not to further detract, but Brebbia for a while offered these odd diffusers that clipped into the opening at the bit's button. They had about six holes that spread the smoke out over the mouth. Interesting idea, but I didn't get into it.

Truthfully, I like the idea of these "dual exhaust" stems more. I've never smoked one.

8)

 

[RDPipes]

Maybe I should have just asked, "Lets See your Radice Twin Bore Stems"
That should solve that little problem.:suspect: 

 

[Kyle Weiss]

Dammit, you redneck sumb!tch, quit complicatin' stuff! :lol:

 

[Anonymous]

Well, the second example is doable with a mill by inserting the central portion as a later plug. Was it you that showed a double where the center was a yellow insert at the bit/bud/whatever? That'd be easy to accomplish.

The upper one would be a bigger pain to fabricate with the extra work/expansion that appears to be done at the junction.

Isn't what your really saying is that you think your pipe has a knockoff of that only looks like the original design? OK, but that doesn't really ID who did that.

 

[RDPipes]

Ken, It wasn't me that posted that, I've never seen one with a yellow plug.
No, Mines an original that someone had modified and I restored back to original.
What my question is, did they make them both ways with a "V" and without. Judging by the two documents I posted it looks like they did it both ways but, the photo doesn't show the end of the stem to verify this and the other is just a diagram drawing. It just be much easier for some of the guys that have twin bores to post a photo and or verify they have seen or have them in both variations.

 

[Anonymous]

I get it. You think they are clear stems. There may be some that are but those I've seen -- granted not a lot -- all had black stems. I don't think that top pic was an actual stem but an advertising mockup. To me anyway, it most resembles artwork.

 

[RDPipes]

Oh! They made them in clear stems sir, I had one in my hand but someone had either really screwed the "V" up while trying to clean it or it was one that someone tried to modify.

 

[ftrplt]

No can do picture; but here goes my description. Mine is a clear-stemmed bent with the two dots on top denoting a twin-bore. The main draft line goes up the stem until it reaches the "bend." Then..from the button, two parallel lines are drilled; the last (maybe 1/4") inside portion opens into the sides of the main line. There is no "Y" at the button; just two parallel holes. Works extremely well and is reasonable easy to clean!! FTRPLT

 

[RDPipes]

No can do picture; but here goes my description. Mine is a clear-stemmed bent with the two dots on top denoting a twin-bore. The main draft line goes up the stem until it reaches the "bend." Then..from the button, two parallel lines are drilled; the last (maybe 1/4") inside portion opens into the sides of the main line. There is no "Y" at the button; just two parallel holes. Works extremely well and is reasonable easy to clean!! FTRPLT

Thank you for responding Ftrplt ,In other words no "V" cut at the button, correct?

 

[docwatson]

Ron,
I have had at least 5 twin bores and all of them were like the second photo that you posted having 2 separate holes in the button. Although the first photo shows the two holes opened together at the button I've never seen a pipe like that, but I'm sure some must have been made that way if the advertisement clearly shows that.

 

[RDPipes]

Ron,
I have had at least 5 twin bores and all of them were like the second photo that you posted having 2 separate holes in the button. Although the first photo shows the two holes opened together at the button I've never seen a pipe like that, but I'm sure some must have been made that way if the advertisement clearly shows that.

Yes sir, I agree and I respect your knowledge without doubt but, my own curiosity would just like to see one like in the 1st photo from the button end to confirm it's just not an optical illusion of the photo.

 

[ftrplt]

No can do picture; but here goes my description. Mine is a clear-stemmed bent with the two dots on top denoting a twin-bore. The main draft line goes up the stem until it reaches the "bend." Then..from the button, two parallel lines are drilled; the last (maybe 1/4") inside portion opens into the sides of the main line. There is no "Y" at the button; just two parallel holes. Works extremely well and is reasonable easy to clean!! FTRPLT

Thank you for responding Ftrplt ,In other words no "V" cut at the button, correct?

Nope, no "V." Took'er out last night for a fine smoke with some Dan Tobacco London Blend. Smokes smooth as silk!!!!!!! FTRPLT

 

[RDPipes]

Okay! Thanks again sir.