Old briar, new expectations, and the people who love them.

[Kyle Weiss]

"When we have to work hard for what we think we know, we tend to cling more tightly to it." Greg put toward the end of this article...

http://pipesmagazine.com/blog/out-of-the-ashes/have-your-cake/

I've heard people say often, "Old briar smokes better." It's an interesting thought, especially for me, who loves looking a good deal on an estate pipe, the history of who the former owner(s) might have been, and what in today's drive-through, instant-gratification world sees in "vintatge" (i.e., "obviously superior") items.

Yet I'm torn: I get a new pipe, either turned by a small-time carver, or heck, some piece of briar I attempted to hack and whittle with delusions of grandeur pretending I'm a pipe carver, and often they're performing just lovely right out of the gate for a first smoke.

"...it seems today’s pipes are of an overall higher quality, being much better behaved overall," said in reference to the sheer demand over the years because we, as pipe smokers, have been regaled as "curious hobbyists" over being consumers in the millions. So, smaller and younger burls, but better burls. It's an interesting theory giving favor to today's comparatively boutique interest in pipes.

Many thanks to the fine gentlemen who unwittingly broke their pipes in for me, probably decades before I was born, so the trepidation of smoking a pipe that's at least new to me likely won't be as harsh as it might have been to them. Coupled with the idea today's pipes might just be some choice smokers by comparison when new...we're really spoiled right now, aren't we?

8)

 

[Dutch]

Kyle, I wholeheartedly agree! Some of these older pipes are Grade A smokers, the only drawback sometimes being that the stem work leaves a little to be desired. In which case, dropping an extra $20-$30 for a replacement hand cut stem is a no-brainer.

 

[Kyle Weiss]

Don't I know it...even if it comes down to "...ah crap, I love this old estate pipe, but that green stem..." ale: Sometimes I just don't want to do the work to make it shine. It is work.

Plus, I don't think I've had a "bad break in" in a new pipe (not just "new old stock") yet...again, feeling quite spoiled to enter in to this when I did...excluding my teen years of Grabows and Prince Albert/Borkum Riff. *sigh*

8)

 

[riff raff]

I have an old car and old motorcycles, so old pipes just appeal to me. I usually can't wait to start the restoration process so I can enjoy it for the first time in pristine condition. This baby came on a Friday afternoon, she was reamed and soaking with salt/alcohol before dinner. I woke up at 5 AM Saturday morning and headed to the shop with a cup of coffee. By noon time, I was enjoying the first smoke, wondering what journeys it had undertaken. That is a magic moment for me.

 

[plumbernater]

Any one ever ride in a old hourse pulled wagon. Ilike todays cars the look, the ride, the performance. And like the pipe the price is going up. But you ride in that horse pulled wagon, You experiance some thing better. You see things you wouldnt see in that car going so fast, It takes one back to a time gone by. You hear things, smell things. In other words you have a expriance that you dont get in that car.

 

[Kyle Weiss]

Since RR and plumber both mention cars...I'm not sure they're exactly in the same category as pipes quite as directly. As Greg mentions in his article, pipes were being churned out en masse which isn't happening today. Today, everything is made by the truckload, especially vehicles, and shipped off lickety-split...pipes have slowed down in production and demand, but that demand has some heart once again.

Imagine if cars went out of favor. They wouldn't be illegal, but just something else took over or caught the public's interest. There'd be cars. Plenty of them. For the rest of us. People might even start making them by hand in their garages and in small operations, and they'd appeal to enthusiasts, maybe people yearning for the times now passed. They'd be available in better configurations, better quality and probably made by hand in some instances--for a very good price. They'd drive well and be a curious piece of art and beauty for all who witnessed you driving it (though they themselves couldn't handle the maintenance, enthusiasm or appreciation for what all was involved...)

That's how pipes are in a mechanical metaphorical sense to me. The old stuff is good, filled with history and notions unto itself, the new stuff is good, with more care and better use of materials available. A better, rarer, but available car--or a buggy. All with soul.

8)

 

[monbla256]

Having aquired a little over 80 pipes since 1969, and bought ALL but 3 new, I have "broken" in everyone I have except the three recently purchased "estates" and have to say that they ALL smoke BETTER as they have gotten older with about 12 being my best smokers which I bought between 1969 and 1975. They are also not necessarily my "high end" Charatans either with several being some of my lower priced Brits such as my BBB's and GBD's and Hardcastles and Sasieni's . I think the amount of time a pipe is smoked and how has much more to do with it's "smoking quality" than just it's manufacterer's product only. Greg brought up some good points in this direction in his article and I have to agree with his enjoyment with that "first" smoke in a new pipe! If I did not have as manny pipes as I have , and was down around Kyles age, I would definately be aquiring more new pipes, but at the place where I am chronologically in life, I'll just enjoy the different tobacco's in what I have now !!!

 

[Kyle Weiss]

Exactly.

Even if the pipes of yesterday were, side-by-side, a little more "manufactured" without as much regard to (what we know today as) quality as they were to satisfying demand, they've been seasoned by time and smoking--which is why I say, right now, we're really effing lucky.

On top of that, look at the tobacco quality and choices we have.

:cheers:

8)

 

[cigrmaster]

I personally enjoy breaking in a new pipe especially when it is a naked bowl. I like watching the cake develop and I like knowing exactly what has been smoked in it. I have many estates and only buy ones that have been professionally cleaned. I do not have any talent in regards to refurbishing a pipe, or the tools to do a proper job, so I leave it up to people far more qualified. I do enjoy the fact that my estate pieces have already been broken in and building a new cake is also fun with those. I also like the fact that some of my estate pieces are very old( 50 plus years) and that they have a history. I guess I am saying I love them all, estate, new anything that will smoke my favorite blends cool and dry are great in my book. It is amazing at how many choices we are afforded in regards to pipes and different tobacco's, I think it is a great time to be a pipe smoker.

 

[plumbernater]

All in all the pipes of today that Kyle is talking about. Give them 30 years or so and they will be old. they will smoke like the estate pipe of today. Its a circle of smoke rings :roll:

 

[Kyle Weiss]

Sort of, not really. Greg's article kind outlines what I'm saying, I'm just adding to it... he's talking about old VERSUS new,and I'm not. I'm saying yes, it's possible to have our cake and eat it too, these days. Mainly because old-new-stock from yesteryear is dried and mellowed (theory), older used pipes have been broken in for us to enjoy today, provided they've been taken care of (fact), and more choices of smaller-maker pipes available to us (a smaller demographic than 40 years ago) new today both machine and handmade are of excellent briar choice and flavor. Ergo, we all win.

8)

 

[Anonymous]

Repeating a bunch of previous rants here.

1) Age : You have your choice of a brand new Martin D-28. Or one made in 1935. In great shape.

Choose.

A brand new Les Paul. Or a 1959 one. In great shape.

Choose

A late-production Dunhill black shell billiard. Or one from the patent era. In great shape.

Choose.

It takes adequate age and proper use to realise the potential in anything made of wood that performs any task more complex than hitting a baseball or getting knocked over by a bowling ball.

2) The whole "hand-made" trip is, IMHO, a trip.

What a lot of you guys call (and seem to think is) "carving" or "sculpture" is proficiency with sandpaper.

Taking nothing away from them, but it is not surprising to me that the great majority of modern, "artist" pipes are not classic "shape pipes," but free-form fantasies. Guys (& gals, since there are some now) with artistic imaginations can do neat stuff pretty much right off the bat. But (if you don't believe me, ask the honest big-time pros) matching the standard of the old Brits (Barling, BBB, GBD, Comoy, Dunhill) in classic shapes where it's either right or it's wrong with no room for "interpretation" is one of their hardest tests.

The old guys did it "the easy way" with the ancestors of CDC machines. And when these turned out flawless, getting finished right on their intended specs, they were (and are) inimitable.

But HOW they did it means squat. The fact is, they did it. And so many times that people can more or less afford examples of this. So long as you're content with a blue collar brand nobody's started a run on (yet) (I'd pick Hardcastle out of a hat. Or Civic), if you're picky, and content to live with the clean-up, de-tox and (oftentimes at least ideally) now stems involved, you can smoke like a king on the budget of the gardener. And with no-names especially.

3) The "hook" with a new pipe is that you (internet) "know" the one who made it. At least by reputation. You're participating (as it were) in current history. Connected with the greater scheme of things pipeular.

The "hook" with an old one (beauty aside) is that it's a souveneir. Like the sea shells you took home with you remind you of the trip to the ocean you took, an "estate pipe" is a tangible connection with (in the case of one I'm looking at as I type this, Ireland, back before the uprising. Another one of London in the aftermath of WW-II) its past.

Only in the abstract world of mathematics does the whole equal the sum of its parts. With pipes, as with violins and marriages, the whole can be greater than the sum of its parts.

What's left, then ? Accurate drilling ? The old English & Irish did that pretty well as a rule (although they sometimes made draws on the tighter side to make it harder for idiots to burn them out & want replacements).

"Moderns are better" here ? Ask George Dibos how many high-end Italians he's been sent to turn into smokeable pipes. (And Dunhills and others).

:face:

 

[monbla256]

Ther ya go agin Yak. Punching everyones baloons ! To think that an "artisan" or "engineered" pipe could not be BETTER than the older mass-produced "machine made" stuff of years ago, BLASPHEMOUS Your taking all the "romance" out of it :twisted:

 

[desertpiper]

A while ago I made a post about pipe perfection. That had something to do with a great smoking pipe that was mass produced was really a bunch of perfect little accidents. And I think that still holds today, as far as mass produced pipes go. The machines that can be used today are more precise and more repeatable than the machines of yesteryear. So I have to believe that high production pipes made today are of better quality than high production pipes made in years past. Now keep in mind I'm only talking about high production pipes, not hand made or mostly hand made. Those pipes can be tinkered with to produce a very good smoking pipes. And given today's industry where every little detail has a cost assigned to it. I think that makes tinkering and modifying harder to do. So I would give low production of the past the nod there. This is just my opinion, and knowledge of manufacturing.

 

[riff raff]

As usual, nicely summed up Yak.

Factory made pipes always seem to take a back seat to prestigious artisan pipes, but they sure had a level of consistency that is hard to believe. I always marvel at pipes made by the usual suspects, but so far, only a classic shape from a storied maker makes me reach for the "buy" button.

 

[Kyle Weiss]

The beauty is:

You can choose "both" in either case, and are likely lucky enough to score. Our money goes just as far, per capita (for now), and we get (what I believe are) overall better smokes with better choices.

But if you must choose some "side," as in be a Factory Guy or a Artisan Guy, that's fine. The gray area of inexpensive artisan pipes that smoke wonderfully (sometimes from our own Brothers) versus expensive factory-made pipes that might smoke like a toothbrush.

Yeah, I get it: the "artisan" makers have a niche, and there's guys that think it's the only way to go. It isn't, by a long shot--but if you do go that way, it isn't as if money is wasted, just placed on different points of importance.

I'd take a pipe that's ugly that smokes brilliantly any day, but the beauty is--I don't have to: there's plenty of ugly old pipes, beautiful old pipes, simple old pipes and some contemporary beauties being made in garages that all can do quite well.

Maybe I just haven't met a real pipe snob yet. :lol:

8)

 

[desertpiper]

We must live in a pretty good age when we can have this friendly debate. Think about it we can buy quality old pipes, quality new pipes at pretty reasonable prices. And if you want you can buy quality old pipe and quality new pipes pretty high prices. Something for everyone. Wonderful time to smoke pipes!

 

[Kyle Weiss]

The New Golden Era of the Pipe, if you ask me.

Too bad legislation is eventually going to ruin it for us.

There, if you're gonna pee on a parade, might as well do it right. :lol:



8)

 

[riff raff]

We must live in a pretty good age when we can have this friendly debate. Think about it we can buy quality old pipes, quality new pipes at pretty reasonable prices. And if you want you can buy quality old pipe and quality new pipes pretty high prices. Something for everyone. Wonderful time to smoke pipes!

Yep, we're pretty fortunate in a web-connected world. 20 years ago there were no forums, with classifieds and Paypal to buy virtually any pipe maker, and of course no Ebay as well. Pipe shops and their inventory were a pipe smokers only choice, unless they had the opportunity to travel a good bit.

 

[user 2031]

The New Golden Era of the Pipe, if you ask me.

Too bad legislation is eventually going to ruin it for us.

There, if you're gonna pee on a parade, might as well do it right. :lol:



8)

Well, yeah... but won't we be better off once Big Brother eliminates all of our unhealthy choices and then makes all of our decisions for us??? I know I'm looking forward to it! :lol: :no: