Dunhill

[monbla256]

Well, this thread made 6 pages but what would one expect considering the question If you want to stir up a hornets nest of emotions, as far as pipes go ask this question "... what makes a Dunhill worth so much?" Folks, the pipes are WORTH what a retailer or individual can get $ wise for each one. The same can be said for Charatans, GBD's, etal. I have 4 Dunhills, bought new, back when you could still buy them for under $100.00. I felt they were worth what I paid at the time, I felt the same way about my new Charatan's and GBD's etc. back then. ANY pipe is WORTH what the market will bear. It's all about sales. You may not agree but that's what it is. And a pipe is NOT a shotgun so that analogy get's "shot to hell" as well JMHO :twisted:

 

[Kyle Weiss]

Well, one good, obvious repeat deserves another, I suppose. :lol:

My goal at this point is, for a screamin' good deal, to purchase one of the ugliest mother-effing Dunhill pipes I can find. Not due to abuse or error, but simply a design (and I've seen them) that just sucks. When people scoff and tease me (as they do in good humor; I deserve it) I can deadpan and turn to them and declare the poor pipe's pedigree. I hope it smokes wonderfully, too.

It'll be a good social experiment.

8)

 

[KevinM]

Remember Marketing 101 and the discussion of pricing models? Dunhill is an example of an early app of the concept -- i.e, produce a quality product and price it so that the brand gives the buyer a sense of status and exclusivity. Tell people they can buy success, or the illusion of it.

This also explains the existence of anti-Dunhillians. Many pipers, by choice or necessity, will not pay more than functionality and a curt nod to aesthetics require.

But there's a pertinent though often overlooked point in the case of pipes. You can buy a perfectly good, say, Jobey POY for $100 as I recently did. It's a light-as-a-feather beauty with wonderful flame grain. My Jobey, however, has zero snob value.

For, let's say, $500, I could have bought a Dunhill. Could I afford the extra $400? Sure. Most working people can wangle the Dunhill, if not in cash then in plastic. Wanting a $500 pipe is not exactly a stretch for the unreachable stars. It's not like a wing-shooting enthusiast coveting a gun that goes for the price of a new car. It's unlikely anyone would miss a meal due to my (or your) splurge on a Dunhill. So the real question, to my mind is, If you're a piper, why wouldn't you at some point treat yourself to the Dunnie?

For me the answer is economic and practical: I'd rather have the extra $400 in the bank. Or for the difference I can have the pipe and a nifty digital camera. Plus, I don't believe the Dunnie will smoke better than what I got. I'm not willing to pay extra simply to impress. Other opinions may vary. Fine, I have no quarrel.

My dear daughter, responding to my Q about what she learned in her marketing class: "There's a chapter on you in my textbook! It's titled, "The Value Consumer." Value consumers don't pay extra to impress.

 

[riff raff]

I had a Dunhill, 2002 Group 5 and sold it. No regrets, but I'm sure that I would still be pining for at least one in my pipe-smoking life if I hadn't bought and smoked that one. I'd buy another, in the right shape and year, but probably not a new one.

That Parker bulldog sure looks like a smart buy, very handsome! Forrestmattia always has some nice, reasonably priced choices.

 

[J Soshae]

Wow! That is the biggest tin of Nightcap I have ever seen.

 

[SpeedyPete]

Wow! That is the biggest tin of Nightcap I have ever seen.

.....and I did not realise until now that I've bought a monster of a pipe!!! Hope it will arrive this week. :bounce:

 

[riff raff]

Sorry guys, I couldn't figure a way to make that pix smaller.....

 

[Kyle Weiss]

Some forums thumbnail or even auto-resize so the frames won't get messed up by big picture posts. Just not this one. 8)

 

[monbla256]

Sorry guys, I couldn't figure a way to make that pix smaller.....

Check your photo hosting site, most have a re-sizing tool for you to use.

 

[KevinM]

Speaking of Dunnies, what's the story on Hardcastle pipes? I hear so much about the few pipes that pass Dunhills' Q control that I have to wonder what happens to all those perfectly good pipes that have imperfections I could probably live with, assuming I was smart enough to find them. Do these "rejects" become Hardcastles? Or not? Or what?

 

[SpeedyPete]

Or what?

Or what what?? :lol:

 

[KevinM]

Yah, I shouilda stopped when I was ahead. My Q, stated more succinctly, is, Are Dunhill "rejects" marketed as Hardcastles?

When I've seen the question addressed, the answer always seems to have built-in wriggle room. But it's the sort of thing that value buyers might be interested in.

So does anyone know anything about this matter?

 

[loneredtree]

Parker is the Dunhill second brand name.

 

[monbla256]

Parker is the Dunhill second brand name.

Once again, Dunhill states that they make no seconds. The Parker and Hardcastle Pipe firms ARE owned by the holding company that owns Dunhill and they are in adjoining buildings in England. But Parker-Hardcastle pipes are there own entity. Even if they use the rejected stummels from Dunhill, unless the pipe is marked Dunhill and the firm says in it's literature that Parker-Hardcastles are the second line, which they don't, there are NO seconds Dunhills. But if you guys want them to be Dunhill seconds, I won't stop ya

 

[KevinM]

Okay, is it fair to say that this is a marketing ploy of Dunhill? Dunhill advertises that only 5% of briar blocks that begin as potential Dunhill material actually have the right stuff. That leaves a lot of expensive raw material to dispose of. So the other 95% is handed off to the neighbors, Parker and Hardcastle. I'm assuming -- no way of knowing for sure -- that some sliver of this 95% might have made it to some point in the Dunhill production process before a flaw was detected and the pipe was demoted. These become Parker and Hardcastles since, officially, there's no such animal as a Dunny second This helps maintain the Dunhill image of quality, exclusivity and high end pricing while avoiding the overhead cost of trashing satisfactory but not perfect raw material. Dunhill is the Lexus, while Parker and Hardcastle are Toyota, and you'll never see them in the same showroom.

 

[monbla256]

Okay, is it fair to say that this is a marketing ploy of Dunhill? Dunhill advertises that only 5% of briar blocks that begin as potential Dunhill material actually have the right stuff. That leaves a lot of expensive raw material to dispose of. So the other 95% is handed off to the neighbors, Parker and Hardcastle. I'm assuming -- no way of knowing for sure -- that some sliver of this 95% might have made it to some point in the Dunhill production process before a flaw was detected and the pipe was demoted. These become Parker and Hardcastles since, officially, there's no such animal as a Dunny second This helps maintain the Dunhill image of quality, exclusivity and high end pricing while avoiding the overhead cost of trashing satisfactory but not perfect raw material. Dunhill is the Lexus, while Parker and Hardcastle are Toyota, and you'll never see them in the same showroom.

BINGO!! It's all marketing as it always has been with Dunhill. They were and are MASTERS at the exclusivity model in the pipe world. So you decide what you want to believe and if any of it is of importance to you as far as a Dunhill. :twisted:

 

[KevinM]

Ah, the fog has lifted quite a bit. I was wondering about this subject, because a well known pipe retailer with the initials COJ and advertises as the largest US Dunhill retailer has interesting stuff on its Web page of pipe manufactuers. If you choose "pipes" on the COJ site and then scroll down through the lengthy list you come to an alphabetical listing of links. In it you will find "Hardcastle by Dunhill" and "Parker by Dunhill," both of which are in the low to moderate pricing categories. This is intriguing, even though a retailer's advertising language doesn't necessarily reflect the intent of the manufacturer. Or, perhaps the wily Dunhill marketeers have a way to maintain deniability, the rascals.

 

[SpeedyPete]

Ah, the fog has lifted quite a bit. I was wondering about this subject, because a well known pipe retailer with the initials COJ and advertises as the largest US Dunhill retailer has interesting stuff on its Web page of pipe manufactuers. If you choose "pipes" on the COJ site and then scroll down through the lengthy list you come to an alphabetical listing of links. In it you will find "Hardcastle by Dunhill" and "Parker by Dunhill," both of which are in the low to moderate pricing categories. This is intriguing, even though a retailer's advertising language doesn't necessarily reflect the intent of the manufacturer. Or, perhaps the wily Dunhill marketeers have a way to maintain deniability, the rascals.

The Parker and Hardcastle names will be changed soon, I believe.

It will in future be known as Parkhill and Duncastle pipes.

 

[Hermit]

Okay, is it fair to say that this is a marketing ploy of Dunhill? Dunhill advertises that only 5% of briar blocks that begin as potential Dunhill material actually have the right stuff. That leaves a lot of expensive raw material to dispose of. So the other 95% is handed off to the neighbors, Parker and Hardcastle. I'm assuming -- no way of knowing for sure -- that some sliver of this 95% might have made it to some point in the Dunhill production process before a flaw was detected and the pipe was demoted. These become Parker and Hardcastles since, officially, there's no such animal as a Dunny second This helps maintain the Dunhill image of quality, exclusivity and high end pricing while avoiding the overhead cost of trashing satisfactory but not perfect raw material. Dunhill is the Lexus, while Parker and Hardcastle are Toyota, and you'll never see them in the same showroom.

BINGO!! It's all marketing as it always has been with Dunhill. They were and are MASTERS at the exclusivity model in the pipe world. So you decide what you want to believe and if any of it is of importance to you as far as a Dunhill. :twisted:

Absolutely. They musta had a really crappy supplier if 95% of it was rejected. :lol:

 

[SpeedyPete]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/180933772922?ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1431.l2649

This pipe is MINE!!!

It arrived today, my Dunhill by Parker!!!!!!!!!!!!

As usual, the pipe is even better condition than what Nathan described.

I'm a happy chappie!! :cheers: