Guess who's the newest Peterson initiate?

[Puff Daddy]

... a two step method which left a larger primary tenon hole with the airway the smaller offset at the angle needed and that they were NOT System pipes!

This is correct. If you look at the cut-out diagrams showing a true system pipe you'll find an intentionally deep well/reservoir. Kyle's pipe is simply one where the mortise was drilled to accept the tenon, but the drilling is rounded at the end and goes slightly deeper than the tenon. A system reservoir will be a whole lot deeper, a whole lot. The actual airway going from the mortise into the bottom of the bowl is drilled high like that precisely so it will be straight and hit dead center bottom of the bowl. Engineering choice, simple, easy to replicate, straightforward.

For all these variations, oddities and aggravations, you have to remember that the offset is the cheap price (relatively) and the excellent styles available. They're just Petes, gotta love em for what they are.

Harlock, didn't you know that every Peterson comes with a string of rosary beads and an admonition to perform 10 hail Marys before use? I believe this dates back to the old ties the company founders had with the local Abbey Our Lady of Perpetual Aggravation.

 

[Kyle Weiss]

So, the same day I got my 80S, a friend bought a black-painted Pete System 305. Before he smoked it, I compared the two. The "well" he had drilled was only about 2mm deeper than on my 80S. Not knowing any better, we both just shrugged and went on with smoking. I was surprised at the almost inch-deep "reservoir" I had while only about 3/8" of the mortise occupied by the tenon in the given drilled space.

So...things I have learned thus far: There's many variations in Petes. Some are System by breed, some are false systems, some are Systems but weren't built like other Systems so they're non-System Systems, and require some form of personal guilt and religious flagellation in order to fully understand. The Internet wins again. :lol:

The part I care about: this pipe smokes awesome.

8)

 

[Anonymous]

A system reservoir will be a whole lot deeper, a whole lot.

True. But there has to be enough room in the stummel for it to be a whole lot deeper. In an 80S, there isn't. So they did what they could.

That's my story & I'm sticking to it :lol!:

:face:

 

[monbla256]

Monbla, did you remind them you have been smoking for 400 years?

This is why I was wondering if it's just a labeling/nomenclature thing: from other System Petes I've seen, this includes the somewhat ridiculous design of straight pipes that are considered "System," there's a space chamber drilled strikingly similar in my 80S. So, are all Peterson pipes drilled with some "two step process" making them resemble so closely a System? Or are there also models that have the standard mortise/tenon setup that meets snugly with no gaps?

On another note regarding Yak's 80S epiphany... I'm having some Kendal Plug (a little Irish/Brit conflict going on) in the hotly-debated 80S in question, and all cylinders are firing. This pipe is making m very, very happy. 8) I'm glad I held out for this one.

No, I only told 'em about the first 200 years. Some of them have a couple of 100 years on me anyway :twisted: This got me wondering and I checked out my two other 80s's and another 999 that I have along with two 150's and a 606 and ALL have that two step big tenon drilling w/ the airway slightly off center. It must be the nature of a Pete so to speak. They say what's a System and the rest of the world knows better :twisted: Doesn't really matter as they are such good smoking pipes !!

 

[Puff Daddy]

You're right Yak. I misread Kyle's earlier post, thought he said the extra space beyond the tenon was 2mm. Looks like you got the system/non intentionally system variant :lol:

 

[Puff Daddy]

10 more hail Marys for me....... :evil:

 

[Kyle Weiss]

You're right Yak. I misread Kyle's earlier post, thought he said the extra space beyond the tenon was 2mm. Looks like you got the system/non intentionally system variant :lol:

I hate it when Yak's right too... Heheheh ...but yeah, the well itself is 2 - 4mm beyond the draft hole (guess) and stuff does pool up in there. With Monbla's checking, it might be just the way these are made, but because they aren't exactly designed like the original system, they may just drill 'em that way and make these non-intentional partial system type pipes. It seems to work. Well, one thing is for sure, there's enough passion and following with Petes to stir up some healthy, passionate debate--and now, finally, I know why. 8)


...if anyone has a burnout on an 80S with a similar setup, let's cut the sucker in half and find out what's going on. :twisted:

 

[monbla256]

10 more hail Marys for me....... :evil:

You must not have an Irish priest at your parish, they ALWAYS give you at LEAST 12, sometimes MORE Hail Mary's AND usually a Rosary or two to say!!

 

[Puff Daddy]

... just the way these are made, but because they aren't exactly designed like the original system, they may just drill 'em that way and make these non-intentional partial system type pipes. It seems to work.

This is my belief as well. I have 4 999's and an 80S (with one more on the way, eventually), they are all drilled like yours but none are actual system pipes, AFAIK. At least they're not stated as such. The 80S is not listed as a system pipe in the system shape chart [ http://www.peterson.ie/pipes/system.html ] nor is the 999. If you look at the cut-out diagram on the page I linked to, it appears that the system pipe stem is part of the package deal in making a pipe a system pipe. The internals of the system stem, whether P lip or fishtail, are different than the standard stems in that they have more open volume in the tenon end and actually fit as a military type mount. Package deal, I think, though the drilling of the mortise can often seem to be quite similar.

One thing worth noting, on the 999's I have that are not silver military mounts, the flush fitting tenons all needed to be counter sunk to smoke without a gurgle. They sell them with dead flat flush tenons, and a little countersink funnel goes a long way to making the pipe sing. They should implement this step in their production, IMHO.

 

[MisterE]

I'm having MacB Navy Flake in a Peterson now (seriously). Kind of like merging two threads...

From what I remember, the sytem design simply has an expanded and deeper reservoir chamber than a standard one. No major differences other than the dimensions. The straight system pipes are really odd little creatures though. Don't most of the system pipes have military push/pull bits to allow for the wider drill bit?

 

[Kyle Weiss]

If you look at the cut-out diagram on the page I linked to, it appears that the system pipe stem is part of the package deal in making a pipe a system pipe. The internals of the system stem, whether P lip or fishtail, are different than the standard stems in that they have more open volume in the tenon end and actually fit as a military type mount. Package deal, I think, though the drilling of the mortise can often seem to be quite similar.

One thing worth noting, on the 999's I have that are not silver military mounts, the flush fitting tenons all needed to be counter sunk to smoke without a gurgle. They sell them with dead flat flush tenons, and a little countersink funnel goes a long way to making the pipe sing. They should implement this step in their production, IMHO.

This was the difference between my buddy's 305 System and my 80S...the stem on his is WIDE at the tenon (military, I would think), wherein mine is marginally wide and flush-mount (by comparison to non-Peterson pipes). All I know is whatever they did to this one, it's effing perfect, and has a "system-like" effect.

For all others: Kendal Plug in this pipe is astonishing. My tongue was a bit raw yesterday as I smoked a lot (three times :shock: ) and I'm getting zero bite, all flavor, and total bliss.

 

[George Kaplan]

Don't most of the system pipes have military push/pull bits to allow for the wider drill bit?

All those listed as System pipes seem to. Great minds think alike, E. I've got some Navy Flake burning right now in my army mount 31.

 

[s.ireland]

That is a very good looking Pete, Kyle! No wonder you had to have it! It's not everyday one comes across a "lower end" (not Supreme or gold spigot or whatever) Pete with grain that nice! Enjoy! :cheers:

 

[Kyle Weiss]

That is a very good looking Pete, Kyle! No wonder you had to have it! It's not everyday one comes across a "lower end" (not Supreme or gold spigot or whatever) Pete with grain that nice! Enjoy! :cheers:

Thanks, man--I thought the same thing. Just so you know, that's the pipe the Scottish Flake is likely going to end up in. 8)

 

[Harlock999]

You're all very naughty boys, playing with your Petersons and then talking about it, loudly...

 

[Anonymous]

the well itself is 2 - 4mm beyond the draft hole (guess)

Let's play some Math.

29.85mm deep mortise chamber from the edge, with a 10.15mm wide mortise -- stem is 11.95mm in length at the tenon

029.85 Mortise Depth
-11.95 Tenon Length
_____
017.90 mm.

Excess headspace might be 3-4 mm. 18 is a System Chamber.

:face:

 

[monbla256]

Yak, you need to call Peterson and tell them to get their listing for System pipes correct. As you say the math PROVES it is a System pipe. Of course THEY make the pipes and decide WHAT IS a System pipe but hey, they probably are wrong :roll:

 

[s.ireland]

That is a very good looking Pete, Kyle! No wonder you had to have it! It's not everyday one comes across a "lower end" (not Supreme or gold spigot or whatever) Pete with grain that nice! Enjoy! :cheers:

Thanks, man--I thought the same thing. Just so you know, that's the pipe the Scottish Flake is likely going to end up in. 8)

Be careful.... I have a hunch that your Pete is going to like Scottish flake so much that it won't allow any other blend after it gets that first taste!

 

[MisterE]

You're all very naughty boys, playing with your Petersons and then talking about it, loudly...

Ooo, I think I need to do a few Hail Marys too.

 

[Boxerbuddy]

1st of all, I love the look of that pipe. 80s is my favorite Pete shape and that one is understated and classy as hell. My understanding of a system pipe is that they have the extra chamber drilled at an angle to the the mortise to catch all the moisture that comes through the pipe. I can see how a wide, deep mortise and a short tenon would have the same effect, but I don't know if that is considered a system pipe. If it is, lol my Stanny 185 is a system pipe too. It has a wide mortise to accept the filter tenon(I don't use a filter), and the tenon does not reach the end of the mortise. The draft hole is also drilled at the top of the mortise, I suspect that was just the best place to drill in order to get the draft hole exactly where they wanted it in the chamber.

As for not passing a filter....try this Kyle. My Stanny won't pass a filter for the same reason yours won't, there's a space between the end of the tenon and the end of the mortise coupled with the fact that the draft hole is high, so here's what I do.

I put a slight bend on the last half centimeter of the cleaner...maybe 3/4 of a centimeter, and pass it down the stem with the bend facing downward so the bend in the stem doesn't straighten the cleaner out. When you feel it hit the end of the mortise, turn the cleaner so the bend will face upward and hopefully hit the draft hole. I do this with a series of gentle "trial thrusts" while turning at the same time...you should just feel when and if the end goes through the draft hole.